Crisp traded to KC for reliever

November 19, 2008 at 10:24 AM

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Coco was so-so for the Sox, and now he's a Royal

When Johnny Damon bolted for the the New York Yankees in January of 2006, the Red Sox had a hole in center field. A few weeks later, enter Covelli Loyce Crisp as part of a six player trade with the Cleveland Indians. Boston sacrificed uber-prospect Andy Marte, acquired a few months earlier from the Atlanta Braves, but in return they received a 26 year old center fielder who averaged 15 home runs and hit a .298 clip the past two seasons as a starter.

The deal, on paper, looked like a great trade for the Boston organization. The free agent pool that year was thin; Kenny Loften, Jim Edmonds, and Steve Finley were the best available center fielders. A few months after trading for Crisp, he signed an affordable 3 year, $15.5 million dollar extension. That was probably the high water mark of Crisp's Boston career.

January 27, 2006
Cleveland Indians receieve:	Boston Red Sox recieve:
Andy Marte Guillermo Mota Kelly Shoppach Randy Newsom Cash	Coco Crisp Josh Bard David Riske

Crisp was injured his first year with the team, and hit a dismal .264 in 105 games, mostly from the bottom of the order. His low average and power shortage (he hit only eight home runs) were blamed mostly on his broken finger. However, the next season, in 145 games, Crisp hit .268 with only six long balls. By the end of the 2007 season, the fans were clamoring for Jacoby Ellsbury to take over for the ineffective Crisp.

Coco was so-so during his Boston career, and it is easy to point out his flaws. Nevertheless, it is more important is to remember him for the positive things he contributed in his three years with the local nine. Crisp played gold glove-caliber defense every day, even in the tricky triangles of Fenway Park. This past season, when asked to split time with Ellsbury, Crisp was the consummate professional, never once complaining or demanding a trade.

Coco Crisp - Career numbers with Boston
Year	G	AB	HR	BA	R	SB	E
2006	105	413	8	.264	58	22	1
2007	145	526	6	.268	85	28	1
2008	118	361	7	.283	55	20	2

Now, Tim Dierkes has confirmed with Sports Radio 810 in Kansas City that the Boston Red Sox have traded Coco Crisp to the Royals for reliever Ramon Ramirez. Ramirez is a 27 year old reliever who is under team control until 2012, to this point he is probably best known for being involved in the trade for Shawn Chacon, when the Yankees shipped him and Eduardo Sierra to Colorado.

Usually the thin air at Coors Field is a death sentence for a veteran pitcher, let alone an untested rookie like Ramirez. Ramon thrived in 2006, his first season with the team, posting a 3.46 ERA in 67 2/3 innings pitched. He set a Rockies record by going 15 1/3 innings to start his career without giving up a run, and only surrendered five home runs the entire season.

Last year, with Kansas City, Ramirez had 70 strikeouts in 71 2/3 innings, in addition to 31 walks and six wild pitches. He continues to keep the ball in the ballpark, giving up only two homeruns in the 71 games he appeared in. He should be a major upgrade over Mike TImlin in the 7th or 8th inning role, especially if he can duplicate his 2.64 ERA from last season.

The biggest surprise of this trade is that, well, it was such a surprise. Where was the Boston media on this one? It had been weeks since we heard the Sox were in discussions to trade Crisp, and then suddenly you wake up and bam, he's in KC. I always imagined Crisp being packaged with some prospects as part of a bigger deal, but the trade permitted to team to upgrade the bullpen, cut costs, and give a boost of confidence to Jacoby Ellsbury, who no longer has to look over his shoulder.

Hopefully Kansas City is not done making moves this offseason, as the Crisp trade gives them a glutton of outfielders. Constantly disgruntled and overpaid Jose Guillen would be the player most likely to be traded, assuming someone is willing to take on the two years and 24 million dollars left on his contract. Keep an eye on this situation, because if nothing else, Coco deserves an opportunity to play everyday with a fresh start.

Thanks for your service and professionalism with the team, Coco, and best of luck with the Royals!

Categories: Coco Crisp, Kansas City Royals, Ramon Ramirez

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Discussion

20 Comments on "Crisp traded to KC for reliever"

Posted by Tom A., November 19, 2008 10:41 AM

This seems like a like a pretty good deal to me. Ramirez is locked up through 2012 and could be a solid middle-back of the bullpen reliever. Just think how much of an upgrade he is over Mike Timlin.

Coco, thanks for all your dazzling defense here in Boston and good luck having a full-time spot in KC!

Posted by Tim Daloisio, November 19, 2008 3:45 PM

seems like the comments were busted for a little while there ;)

(1) I am back!!! Jury Duty knocked me out for the last two plus weeks...but I have returned - I know you all missed me right?

(2) Coco served this team well even if he was a "disappointment of sorts". But it's time for Ellsbury to go full time...and even though I don't know Ramirez well, looks like he'll slot into the mix in 7th pretty well.

(3) I would still like to see Monsterson in the pen next year and give Buchholz and/or Bowden a shot at the tail of the rotation.

(4) I would still pursue available FA pitchers and have to believe that Teixeira is in play in a big way.

(5) Lugo for either of the dead weight lefties from Detroit is fine by me!

Posted by M.A.G., November 19, 2008 4:00 PM

Welcome back, Tim.

I like this trade. I don't really know much about Ramon Ramirez, but his numbers are impresive and his stuff looks great. I think he is a major upgrade to the bullpen.

On the other hand, this makes Masterson more probable as a starter... or as trade bait.

Posted by M.A.G., November 19, 2008 4:03 PM

Or, alternatively, make Buchholz or Bowden a little more tradeable. In any case, this trade feels like the beggining of some major moves, or at least I hope so.

Posted by Shane, November 19, 2008 4:54 PM

I like this trade as well. Coco deserves to be an everyday player, and ensuring a solid bullpen is great.

Posted by JaredK, November 19, 2008 4:56 PM

I like it...you want to optimize your value and Crisp was just not going to bring back a top position or pitching prospect. I was hoping we could get a Jerry Blevins type of reliever for him...someone young with some success at the mlb level and some major upside and Ramairez seems to fit the bill. Perhaps they want to start the season with Masterson in the starting mix until Clay or Bowden forces their way into the rotation. I also want to see Masterson in the pen at some point, but as long as our pen is solid I don't mind if that is in July/August and hope it is becasue Clay or Bowden (if not traded) absolutely dominate in Pawtucke

Posted by SamR, November 19, 2008 9:49 PM

Suprise! Wow I never saw this coming. I hope this guy turns out to be a solid innings-eater because I really believe we are going to miss having Crisp as our defensive super-sub for the outfield. He did an awesome job spelling Ells when he was struggling and covering for our various injuries and such. Plus his D is amazing. So yeah. This guy better be good. I understand the need in the middle innings so this could be a great pickup. But we'll have to wait and see.

Interesting first move to open up the offseason. Classic Theo.

Posted by gerry, November 19, 2008 10:00 PM

Where did that come from? In Theo we trust! In one very smart, under the radar move:

1. Coco becomes full time on a team that will love his level of play, and appreciate that he has become one of the class acts in baseball. Thank you Coco for all you did, and for mentoring Jacoby. Great CF and a good man.

2. give Ellsbury a chance to settle into CF, which should benefit his confidence and his game.

3. give our Pen a guy who will (as much as any reliever out there) fit in somewhere between co-set-up with Oki and MDC (and Maybe Justin) and a 6th inning stopper; a K machine who doesn't give up long balls. Could do as well for us as Street, Gregg, or Marte, maybe better. Ram-Ram + Street?

4. release Masterson back to the Rotation. I agree with Jared, giving Buchholz and Bowden more developmental time. This move alone assures a highly talented, very deep 7-man rotation. Watch Theo augment this rotation through a AAA trade.

5. eliminate the absolute necessity of a big $$ FA starter.

6. reduce payroll.

That's some trade! What's next? All the awards and honors brought in by Pedroia, Youk, Matsuzaka, Lester, Bailey, Zinc, Thurston, Hale, Mills, Farrell, and all the reports of glowing health from the walking wounded . . . combined with this trade, have restored my swagger, and it feels great.

Posted by Sean O, November 19, 2008 10:28 PM

Not thrilled, but Christina Karl makes some good points over at BP. Ellsbury is a nothing, Juan Pierre version 2.0, so I hate knowing that he's our CF. I'm hoping this actually leads to Theo trying to help this team unlike last year when he took a 5 month vacation. So, hopefully Bay ends up in right, Drew moves to CF, and we find a good LF.

Anyone but Ellsbury. I don't like overrated singles hitters.

#10

Posted by Sean O, November 19, 2008 10:41 PM

Reading that again I was a little too harsh about Jacoby. I think he has the potential to be an average player who will be relatively cheap, as long as we don't fall in love expecting more than he's capable of producing.

If we have the remote potential to upgrade, CF should not be seen as untouchable by any means. I desperately, desperately wish we had just traded him away last season, when we could've received so much more in return.

#11

Posted by Mark, November 19, 2008 10:49 PM

As a lifelong Royals fan (25+) and a decade long Red Sox fan, I think this is a deal that will benefit both teams. Ramirez, or RamRam as we affectionately called him, was awesome. He's a shut-down, power arm, stud, and will do the BP good. I know that was a frustrating aspect of the '08 Sox for me. KC gets a proven CF that can jump start the offense and knows how to use the leather. Y'all should be excited about RamRam...

#12

Posted by gerry, November 20, 2008 12:17 AM

Sean, I don't think upgrading CF is a priority right now, and I don't know how average Jacoby will be.

With a rookie.292BA, he starts his sophomore year projected to hit .301, and has the demonstrated capability of 10+HR, 100+R, high OBP and 50-60SB. Billy Bean called him the best defensive CF in baseball just a few months ago, and though another zero error season will be difficult, by playing just one position he should continue to steal away runs with web-gem catches. OK. If he accomplishes the above, and replaces Sizemore with a Gold Glove, will he be a keeper?

#13

Posted by Sean O, November 20, 2008 12:22 AM

I don't like impatient singles hitters. He will never develop any power, and he has 0 plate discipline. This is not a recipe for success.

If he has one bad BABIP year, we're looking at a .260/.300/.340 player. Unless he magically develops some patience at the plate, that the red sox farm system somehow didn't manage to beat into him yet, he's never going to be all that good.

If he could trade 20 BA for 40 OBP I'd be more confident in his abilities. But almost his entire value is in his speed, and anything that could cause him to lose a single step could make him below replacement in a heartbeat. And now we're stuck with 500 ABs from him, since we just lost our depth.

If we bring Krapler back, I'm gonna lose it.

#14

Posted by gerry, November 20, 2008 1:08 AM

"almost his entire value is in his speed" may be valid, but only in the sense that "almost Papi's or Fielder's entire value is in his bat". The worth of these two is in their power, which can also be lost.

Jacoby's speed is the foundation for several of the tools which separate him from most outfielders, allowing superior defense, and league leading base-stealing. But even assuming he merely develops into a solid .280 hitter, his speed makes him above average in the same way that Papi's power makes him a star. His speed gets him from 1st to 3rd or home, and 2nd to home (skills not well developed on the Sox, but skills with which the Rays beat us silly), and to create infield hits and turn singles and walke to doubles; and to lead the league in triples, which so often become runs. Would you take Pete Runnels' bat with that speed? What if he becomes a legitimate .301 hitter, with speed and D?

With or without Teixera and Martin, the Sox will again be among baseball's best hitting teams. IMO, Jacoby adds a different and useful dimension to the powerful Sox offense and tight defense. In CF and on the base paths his unique skill set is game changing in its own right.

Re: impatience? You know he is working on that right now. He came up so fast, he had little time in AA, and almost no time in AAA to learn these basics. I remember, like Buchholz, they wanted him in AAA in early 2008 to finish his lessons, but injuries kept him at Fenway. Let's hope he can catch up on this aspect of his training.

#15

Posted by Sam K, November 20, 2008 4:10 AM

Wow, Gerry, way to turn a positive into a negative -- snatching a defeat from the jaws of victory.

Ellsbury is young and was shorted his due developmental time. I agree with you that he probably will never develop power (his swing doesn't seem conducive to that), but you can't rule out the possibility of his OBP improving with maturity. And if that happens -- with his speed -- we could be looking at 70 SB's.

That goes along with GG caliber defense -- which by the way is what differentiates Ells from Juan Pierre. Pierre, despite his speed, is an adequate outfielder at best, making the Ellsbury comparison unjust. Unjust to Ellsbury, that is.

And of course an injury to Ellsbury's legs would greatly detract from his value -- just as injuries to Papi's knees (last year) and wrist (this year) greatly sapped his power and eliminated a lot of his potential value. You take that risk with any athlete.

If Ellsbury stays in shape and keeps up with his flexibility training, there should be no reason to worry. Now, if he were to go on the Griffey Jr. diet & exercise regimin and develop a bubble-butt, yeah we'd be in trouble, but then again, that goes without saying.

#16

Posted by M.A.G, November 20, 2008 9:55 AM

I'm still optimistic about Ellsury. I think the kid is better than we have sees this year, and with a little more experience he can be solid. Having said that, I must say I have concerns about the outfield in the long run, though. And my main concern is Drew. He is good player, but his health make him completely unreliable.

That's why I see as an absolute necesity to re-sign Bay. He is our best outfielder, and he is ready to take a discount to stay in Boston. If he reach the FA his price can skyrockett to Holliday levels. We need to secure one of the spots of the outfield, because, if Ellsbuty fails to develop, Drew succumbs to injury (something more than probable), and we lose Bay, we will be in very bad shape in 2010.

So, the best investment in our outfield for the future is secure Bay, IMHO. And then sign a guy like Baldelli as a fourth outfielder.

But the number one priority is catching. This is the glaring hole we need to adress right now. And not with just some band-aid, but with a truly good player.

#17

Posted by JaredK, November 20, 2008 12:02 PM

We signed Paul McAnulty...sucks to be Josh Bailey today. Pretty good numbers in the minor leagues but will be 28 soon. Basically sounds like a slightly better Josh Bailey who is 2 years younger.

#18

Posted by gerry, November 20, 2008 10:50 PM

SAM, Jacoby's one of the biggest positives and catalysts on the team. I can't wait to see him develop into the best CF in the game: high BA, OBP, BB, R, SB, 2b, 3b and a Gold Glove or two. James predicts a .301BA season. I predict he will add power (maturity and savvy) while reducing K's. Tommy Harper predicts 70SB. His D, during a full year in one position, should also improve, if this is possible.

I agree MAG, J.Bay is critical to this OF. I know Theo will incentivize him to stay. How many HR do you think he will hit at Fenway if he learns to hit consistently to RF or LF? 40+? Imagine the doubles and triples off the monster. Fenway's wall could raise his D and power numbers to new heights.

Bay, Ells, JD ... waayyy above average.

#19

Posted by Sam K, November 20, 2008 11:29 PM

Gerry, I apologize. I addressed that last comment to you, but I meant to address Sean O. Very sorry, Gerry.

Tell you what, my biggest concern in the OF is Drew. Ellsbury's defense alone, even if his batting average is hollow (which I hope won't be the case, but let's assume), is enough to make him an average player. I'd like to see him develop some doubles power, but even if he doesn't, a lot of his trips to first base turn into doubles anyway.

Bay is a very good hitter, and while his bat might not fully replace Manny's, we can't forget the defensive improvement over Manny, which is enough to offset most of the difference in their offensive production.

But Drew, though a good hitter and defender, remains prone to injury, and this creates the necessity of having a very good 4th OF'er. Coco was probably a little TOO good to keep around as our 4th: he's in his prime, and he deserves to play somewhere on an everyday basis, even if that somewhere isn't Boston.

We need to re-up Bay, and Ells needs to improve his on-base ability, but Drew is the real make-or-break candidate in our OF.

#20

Posted by gerry, November 21, 2008 12:58 PM

Thanks Sam, I figured that out, but couldn't miss the chance to keep us positive about Jacoby. Sean, I really wish we had Santana, but am even happier with what Lester, Masterson and Ellsbury (and Moss) have brought to the team.

You are right about Coco in his prime, and I share your concern about J.D. Back pain is debilitating, and hits without warning. JD played nearly a full 2007, and 2/3 of 2008,(a difficult season of short ST prep and extensive early travel.) And he left everything on the field in June, carrying injured team mates on his aching back. Assume a minimum 2/3 2009 season with full ST, easier travel, and healthy team mates. Wouldn't Rocco Baldelli and Jeff Bailey provide superior coverage for JD, while backing LF, CF and 1b? They bring BA, OBP, OPS, HR, RBI and good gloves, at about 1/3 the cost of Coco, Kotsay, Casey. And the big bats of VanEvery, Carter, Thurston are as good as any aging options out there.

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